EE's network has gone backwards by 10 years

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As the title says. EE has, certainly in my area, gone backwards by 10 years.

We are supposed to be improving, with the need to stay connected to the internet being greater than ever before.

But no, EE has gone backwards, to the point where I used to be able to get a faster speed on a Virgin Mobile SIM in a Samsung Galaxy Ace Plus! 

This was when Virgin Mobile used EE's 3G network - and the handset was a 3G HSDPA handset which topped out at 7.2Mbps. The 3G SIM used to constantly hit 2Mbps.

EE's speed today:

https://www.speedtest.net/my-result/a/7909941303

This is not fit for purpose as "the UK's best network for the eighth year running". In actuality, it is the UK's WORST network, and has been in my area for the last 4-8 weeks!

Previously, in my area:

EE 3G (pre-4G days): 15Mbps Band 1

EE 4G (initial, single speed): 30Mbps Band 3, backhaul limited

EE 4G (up to Sept/Oct 2021): 70Mbps Band 3 OR 10Mbps Band 20

EE "4G" (recently): 15Mbps (max)/8Mbps (average) Band 3, 5Mbps (max)/2Mbps (average) Band 20, signal strength significantly weaker than any of the above (even 3G).

Under days of high load, such as events:

EE 3G (pre-4G days): 2Mbps

EE 4G (up to Sept/Oct 21): 5Mbps (min), 10Mbps (average), B3

EE "4G" November 2021: 6Mbps B3, <0.5Mbps B20 (see Speedtest link posted above!).

Note that the 3G tests were previously done on a Samsung Galaxy S4 (DC-HSPA and LTE compatible). The 4G tests were carried out on a Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge or Samsung Galaxy S9+ (both DC-HSPA+, LTE-CA, and VoLTE compatible). The Virgin Mobile reference above was on a Samsung Galaxy Ace Plus (HSDPA 7.2 only) with a 3G SIM card.

Until recently, EE 4G has been absolutely fine.

Recently, EE 4G signal strength has gone down significantly. 

2G is now barely average, though 2G is not fit for purpose in 2021/2022 due to low quality calls and slow data rates.

3G is still strong - I can only assume it is using the same old mast panels, whereas 2G and 4G are using new panels.

4G is considerably weaker: Band 3 is significantly weaker and only receivable in one room of the house. Band 20 is strong, but still weaker than before, and completely swamped/overloaded - see the speedtest link for an example of what to expect in my area!

This is NOT a weak signal area: EE Band 1 3G is still strong, coming from the same mast (and faster than 4G!), Vodafone is strong and offers 120Mbps peak, O2 is strong and offers 90Mbps peak, and 3UK seems to be strong as well (at least according to their coverage checker).

3UK uses the same mast, and same antennae, as EE, due to MBNL, so how is EE becoming so poor as of late?!

I have submitted a request on the EE network status website and am very tempted to give EE a phone call just to see what they can do. Failing that, I may be leaving and going to Vodafone or O2, as they are stronger and faster. EE want to take a payment from my account in a few days, for this month's allowances, well if EE donb't fix their issues it will be the LAST payment they take from my account.

EE need to do something, and fast. (Or slow, if their network team is as bad as the coverage and speed here.)

edit: Good, my minimum term is over, so it's a case of improve, or I move to Vodafone and get 20GB data and Spotify Premium thrown in for £16 per month.

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@jimwillsher wrote:

I've just come across this thread, and make no apologies for bringing it back from the dead.

I'm in the same boat, and went as far as chatting to EE's tech support guys at 4PM on Xmas eve about it.

6 months ago I was able to get 109Mb download and 40Mb upload. In the days leading up to Christmas I was still able to sometimes get 20Mb down but was struggling to get better than 3Mb upload, which is pathetic.

I've done some sleuthing today with cellmapper.net and my Teltonika RUTx09 router. I can now identify exactly which mast I am connected to, which is 8.3Km away from my house. There are six EE stations nearer to me, one of which I can see, however looking at Cellmapper it's not actually transmitting in my direction. I am using an omnidirectional antenna on the roof.

The breakthrough today has been to configure my router to only connect on Band 3. Previously, I could see that I was connecting on Band 3 and Band 20. So for whatever reason, Band 20 was dragging my connection to its knees. Forcing the connection to only use Band 3 is now giving me 50Mb down and 25Mb up, which for this time of day on a public holiday is fairly representative. I will try it again early tomorrow.

Hopefully this helps others in the same boat as me and the OP.

Jim

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I'm still here, don't worry about that! 😄

I wonder if EE did some configuration to that closer mast, and removed a panel from your direction? 109/40 would suggest a good strong signal and would lead me to believe the signal would be coming from a mast much closer than 8.3km. In fact, it's a good job you're using a router and external antennae; I honestly doubt any mobile phone with built in antenna would connect to a mast 8.3km away, unless it was really high powered, and line of sight (and even then, I doubt it would be any more than weak L08).

I've done some more investigating and will post a full update. Still need to do more though...

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Hi @mikeliuk 

I understand in what you're saying, that a mobile phone may not need fast data all the time, but it's better to have too much speed than not enough. If the home internet fails for whatever reason, and I have to resort to tethering, then I need something that is going to be fast and reliable. The same goes for if the phone drops out of range of the wi-fi - and Virgin Media Superhubs (what I am using) are NOT well known for their good wireless signal strength, as they have small antennae hidden in the top of the router (instead of large physical, rotatable antennae as found on other routers that can be purchased).

Anyway...

EE's pathetic excuse for 4G in my area is one to two bars of "4G" Band 3, or full strength Band 20. (I used to have an app that measured dBm readings but this no longer works.) What matters is the speed - barely 15Mbps down and less than 1Mbps up. This is worse than a good COPPER broadband connection (let alone fiber or hybrid co-ax/DOCSIS), and also worse (at least in consistency) than 3G - the latter giving about 12Mbps/4Mbps. 0.75Mbps upload (as seen on 4G Band 3) is too slow for anything - even video calls at low resolutions won't work.

With Band 20 (800MHz), it gets worse - since this is now being relied upon for actual coverage, including OUTDOORS, good luck in getting any decent throughput on that! You won't see 5Mbps - and in peak periods/high loads, well, see my posts I made earlier. (Note that during exceptionally high loads, other networks held up fine!)

The signal strength does increase when you are right on top of the mast, and speeds of 70Mbps - what I had before the "upgrade" (read: downgrade) took place - are reachable. That's still last place, but given the number of users on EE, it's understandable.

However, as soon as you move away by more than a hundred meters or so, the strength plummets - which it shouldn't do. It's almost behaving as if someone forgot to turn the amplifiers on (or at least all the way on), and that the antennae are running in passive mode!

For comparison sake:

1st: Three UK (recently tested): 150Mbps/25Mbps (peak) using a plethora of frequency bands, including Band 32. Note that even on an old banger of a phone (Galaxy S4 - the only thing I have spare at the moment) Three UK still gives over 50Mbps/15Mbps!

2nd: Vodafone UK: still 120Mbps download (can't remember the upload) using Bands 1 and 20. Perfectly fine and a good showing.

3rd: O2 UK: still 90Mbps download (peak) using a variety of bands, mainly Band 40 (dual carrier). Can't remember the upload - but still perfectly passable.

4th: EE UK. Barely 15Mbps/0.75Mbps using Bands 3 (very weak) and 20 (strong - but no better than Vodafone B20 with double the capacity). 3G performs better than this, as does old ADSL broadband (e.g. 15/1 or 17/1 - assuming you're close to your local exchange). Download about 1/10th of Three UK and upload even worse - yet claims to be "the UK's best network for 4G/5G". 

Maybe turning the amplifier up on the local mast that serves me would be a good idea - as well as adding Band 1 4G, Band 7 4G, and possibly even a second 20MHz carrier on Band 3 4G.

In fact, 3G worked better than this even prior to the release of 4G, when everyone was actually using 3G for their connections. The signal strength for 3G was (and still is) good, and with dual carrier mode I was able to hit close to 20Mbps download and 2-3Mbps upload. Those speeds are more consistent and more reliable than what I get nowadays via any source (from EE), so yes, EE definitely HAS gone backwards by 10 years!

Also - you need to get 4G working properly before upgrading everyone to 5G, and switching off 3G. If 3G goes, this area is useless. Maybe canceling the Direct Debit and getting a PAC wouldn't hurt...

[jimwillsher]

I was away this weekend and took my 4GEE with me. I'm unsure which mast I was on as I'm not familiar with that area, but I was getting a consistent 70Mbps for the whole weekend. And crucially, that included the evenings; I didn't get the 90%-95% slowdown (sometimes as low as 2Mbps) that I get on my home 4G during every evening. So that, to me, does suggest a huge capacity problem on my local mast.

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@jimwillsher wrote:

I was away this weekend and took my 4GEE with me. I'm unsure which mast I was on as I'm not familiar with that area, but I was getting a consistent 70Mbps for the whole weekend. And crucially, that included the evenings; I didn't get the 90%-95% slowdown (sometimes as low as 2Mbps) that I get on my home 4G during every evening. So that, to me, does suggest a huge capacity problem on my local mast.

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Glad to hear that your EE was working for you when you went away!

My EE mast used to do something similar, but not to that extent. During peak times, it was about 40Mbps, whereas off peak it was 70Mbps. So still a difference, but nowhere near unusable.

Sadly EE in my area nowadays IS unusable - those lucky enough to get a drop of Band 3 signal (it really is that weak) can expect up to 15Mbps, whereas those that are having to rely on Band 20 can expect to receive a signal of barely 5Mbps - and not even that in areas of high load. (Refer to the OP as to the type of speed expected under high load situations.) 70Mbps is still possible if you are right on top of the mast, but that's about it.

For comparison sake, EE Band 1 3G can deliver 12Mbps down and 3-4Mbps up; Band 1 3G used to deliver 15-20Mbps down and 2-3Mbps up back in the days of DC-HSPA (i.e. before 4G was as widespread as it is now); O2 4G can deliver up to 90Mbps; Vodafone 4G can deliver up to 120Mbps, and Three 4G can deliver up to 150Mbps.

So yes, EE's network HAS gone backwards by 10 years, or more.

[jimwillsher]

I completely agree.

My home router allows me to restrict the bands. I've just done a speedtest now and had reasonable speeds of around 30Mbps. That's fine my needs. But I know that by this evening it'll be down to under 5Mbs.

My upload speeds never drop much below 20Mbps, unless I allow Band 20, in which case they drop to sometimes under 1Mbps.

Sample results

https://www.speedtest.net/result/12654445095

https://www.speedtest.net/result/12523237294

https://www.speedtest.net/result/12523346758

Jim

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@jimwillsher wrote:

I completely agree.

My home router allows me to restrict the bands. I've just done a speedtest now and had reasonable speeds of around 30Mbps. That's fine my needs. But I know that by this evening it'll be down to under 5Mbs.

My upload speeds never drop much below 20Mbps, unless I allow Band 20, in which case they drop to sometimes under 1Mbps.

Sample results

https://www.speedtest.net/result/12654445095

https://www.speedtest.net/result/12523237294

https://www.speedtest.net/result/12523346758

Jim

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Thanks for those speed tests - the first one looked promising but the other ones didn't!

If I restrict my EE SIM to Band 3, I get about 15Mbps. If I restrict my EE SIM to Band 20, it's under 5Mbps. Every other network offers significantly more.

Also, the icing on the cake is that I am being forced off my current plan on March 31, and being moved to a CPI based plan instead. My £10 went up to £10.10 last year. This year, it'll be £11.03! And the service I received this year, compared to last year, is SIGNIFICANTLY worse!

Time to PAC out. The question is, do I go 3UK, do I go Vodafone, or do I go O2? I might just keep an EE PAYG SIM around for the very few times I go out and about (where EE is faster/stronger than anyone else), but my main number is going elsewhere.

[jimwillsher]

I'd avoid Vodafone. We use it for work so I have a Vodafone SIM in my iPhone. Speeds are very consistent, but consistently slow. I can get ~20Mbps any time of day or night.

Three don't know that Scotland exists so their coverage here is terrible.

O2 I've not tried.

For me, EE is still the best. Just nowhere near as "best" as it was a year ago.

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@jimwillsher wrote:

I'd avoid Vodafone. We use it for work so I have a Vodafone SIM in my iPhone. Speeds are very consistent, but consistently slow. I can get ~20Mbps any time of day or night.

Three don't know that Scotland exists so their coverage here is terrible.

O2 I've not tried.

For me, EE is still the best. Just nowhere near as "best" as it was a year ago.

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Well, a constant 20Mbps would be greatly appreciated here, if it was EE - they can't deliver that where I live. I'm really tempted to go Vodafone because they are stronger (overall) in Leicester, plus they are far better than EE where I live currently.

I did a bit more testing today and went up to where the mast is. As well as noticing a new, end fed dipole antenna (which I think is either for DAB as an infill, or a new local FM radio staton? Will have to investigate more). the antenna configuration is still present: a new large panel antenna (presumably for 4G services) and a new small block antenna (5G 3400MHz possibly in future?).

Whatever the case, as far as EE's side of the mast, this only works with pure line of sight - even in strong signal areas from other networks (all networks use masts in the same area), EE's signal is dropping off far too early. My phone is currently flip-flopping between 0-2 bars (between -118dBm/22ASU and -111dBm/29ASU) and 4 bars (-84dBm/56ASU) of Band 20 5MHz. This is indoors and upstairs!

Before the mast panel changes, EE was maxed out at 4 bars Band 3 (can't remember the dBm/ASU, but it was more than -111/29).

The 4G Band 3 did hit 90Mbps at its best, when nearly on top of the mast, but this might be because virtually no-one can receive Band 3.

Most of the town is in a similar predicament: signal far too weak (presumably an issue with the amplifiers?) and relying on Band 20.

It's almost as if the following was true:

Me: who thinks that Higham Ferrers (Northamptonshire) should have just 5MHz bandwidth to cover the town?

EE: *raises hand*

Also EE: We're the UK's best network for 4G!

Me: You think that's possible with just 5MHz bandwidth covering a small town?

Apparently, I've got a new SIM card coming soon, which will apparently solve the issues (I don't think it will). If it doesn't, I'm contacting EE again and canceling my SIM plan.

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Update - July 2022

After taking measurements of signal strength between EE and Three (both use the same panels), I ordered my PAC code. EE is just far too weak and too slow to be reliable in this area.

I am now happy to report that I am a new VOXI/Vodafone member - 4G is nice and strong (what I expect of all networks in this area), and the speed is good. The value for money aspect is better than EE, also - instead of getting 10GB for £11.03 (after an RPI and a CPI increase), I am now getting 30GB for £10.

4G download speeds via Vodafone are usually 50Mbps+ via Bands 1 and 20. This is less than the up to 120Mbps measured previously, but it may be down to the device, or the load on the network: there may well be more Vodafone customers here now that EE has let the area down. Upload speeds are 20-30Mbps.

Interestingly, download speeds even on single carrier 4G are 20-30Mbps - which is better than what EE could provide.

For reference:

EE 4G Band 3 - signal readings approx -110 to -115dBm

EE 4G Band 20 - signal readings approx -70 to -80dBm

3UK 4G Band 3 - signal readings approx -90 to -95dBm 

3UK 4G Band 1 - signal readings approx -95 to -100dBm

3UK 4G Band 20 - signal readings better than -75dBm

Vodafone UK 4G Band 1 - signal readings between -95dBm and -105dBm

Vodafone UK 4G Band 20 - signal readings between -85dBm and -90dBm

Bit of a difference!

Also note that Vodafone (and O2 for that matter) have 2x10MHz spectrum at Band 20 - this is more than EE (and 3UK) who only have 2x5MHz spectrum at Band 20. Given how the latter is a requirement for coverage in this area (if you don't want to be dropped down to 3G), it's no surprise that EE's network really chokes itself, especially under high load.

Success at last.

[ALI1428]

Absolutely right never again with EE **bleep** network. I called them some many times didn't help me just counting day's  to finish and  leave  scrap network