SCAMMED: Third party charges on my bill

[madi86]

Recently, I have discovered I have been charged since last year by BounceGame and TheAppFone service provider on me and my wife account. I contacted EE to get a help on this and found a standard reply "Contact third party" that i have seen on this forum which was not helpful at all by such a reputable company even after escalating the issue. In the end they offer my wife £25 refund which she refused to accept it.

Then i contacted the third party after not getting any help from EE and they explained me their browser pop up story and blame me that i have subscibed to it. In the end after all this rant they offered my a GOODWILL refund of £20. They took 100's of pound from me and my wife account without our consent and EE helped them to do this. I refused to take that amount becasue they mugged me in the brought daylight and in return they are saying goodwill refund! SERIOUSLY?

By looking at posts on this and other forums I am so shocked how may people up till now has been scammed by this company and EE hasn't take any measures to close this loop hole. I can't even imagine how these companies are still operating in UK.

Definately after going through this forum and very much convined EE doesn't care about its customers. May be they are getting some percentage on every charge applied from third party.

Shame on EE allowing your customers to be scammed by these scammers.

[XRaySpeX]

You helped too by not checking your bills & bank a/c's for months on end.

[madi86]

Look like you're a full star contributor on this forum but its difficuilt for me to digest you're suggesting someone to check the monthly statement end of every month and its customer fault when they are not spoting erroneous charges on their account. 

May be its a norm for EE customers here to keep an eye on their bills. 

[XRaySpeX]

I am!

Maybe it's should be the sensible norm for the general population to keep an eye on their bills & bank a/c's, esp. in these days of scams & identity thefts.

[csuwi1]

It's depressing to hear yet another case of this, but don't give up.

My understanding (and I am not a lawyer, just a consumer who has spent a lot of time fighting this) is that the law is on your side here. Whatever EE tell you, they took the money from your account and they are at very least jointly liable for that. Every line of policy, procedure or regulation that they quote is trumped by by the law of the land and they will try to convince you otherwise (indeed, many of their call staff may not realise that), but don't be put off. EE are taking money from you, on behalf of a third party who do not have your permission, and that is theft and fraud, plain and simple.

If you are paying by direct debit and EE refuse to budge, contact your bank and ask them to step in under the terms of the Direct Debit Guarantee. If you are paying by credit card there are similar provisions under the Consumer Credit Act.

Sadly, EE are well aware that fighting for refunds is a difficult and frustrating process, that the regulation is woeful and that most people give up. People who persist do tend to get somewhere eventually, but be stubborn and be noisy. Best of luck.

@XRaySpeX: whether or not it's sensible to check your statements thoroughly each month -- which I won't argue with -- it's unhelpful distraction from the point, which is that a crime has been committed. Forgetting to lock your car door, for example, is unwise but it is not carte blanche for someone to steal it.

[Christopher_G]

Hi @madi86

Welcome to the community.

I'm sorry you feel that you could not find an acceptable resolution with the company who charged you for their service.

I recommend getting in contact with the Phone-paid Services Authority (PSA) who regulate these services.

They will be able to advise you on how to proceed further.

Please let us know how you get on.

Chris

[muggles708]

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@madi86 wrote:

Recently, I have discovered I have been charged since last year by BounceGame and TheAppFone service provider on me and my wife account. I contacted EE to get a help on this and found a standard reply "Contact third party" that i have seen on this forum which was not helpful at all by such a reputable company even after escalating the issue. In the end they offer my wife £25 refund which she refused to accept it.

Then i contacted the third party after not getting any help from EE and they explained me their browser pop up story and blame me that i have subscibed to it. In the end after all this rant they offered my a GOODWILL refund of £20. They took 100's of pound from me and my wife account without our consent and EE helped them to do this. I refused to take that amount becasue they mugged me in the brought daylight and in return they are saying goodwill refund! SERIOUSLY?

Unfortunately this is the way that this ridiculous system works. As @csuwi1 points out, there are laws which are supposed to protect you in these circumstances, but they are ineffective because the companies all deny responsibility and hide behing each other.

EE claim to be only a payment processor, but in reality they will threaten you with a debt collector if you refuse to pay these third parties.

You have done all the right things thus far, and are right to have refused 'goodwill' gestures, as accepting these can weaken your legal position.

My advice would be to take legal action in the small claims court against the company. It is not a daunting process, but you do need follow the process correctly. In every case I am aware of the company has backed down and paid up when they received the letter before action. Full details of actions you can take are here:  http://payforitsucks.co.uk/im-not-getting-anywhere-with-my-case/

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@madi86 wrote:

By looking at posts on this and other forums I am so shocked how may people up till now has been scammed by this company and EE hasn't take any measures to close this loop hole. I can't even imagine how these companies are still operating in UK.

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There are currently a large number of consumers complaining that they were subscribed to one of these 'services' without consent. One way that this can happen is through Andoid malware, which is capable of silently signng consumers up to these services. The PSA (and consequently the networks and service operators) are well aware of this, but have sought to play down the effect of these scams. https://psauthority.org.uk/for-business/android-malware

To be fair to EE they have brought in new rules which should defeat the scammers, at least on this network.

https://clients.txtnation.com/hc/en-us/articles/360000656991-UK-Changes-to-PFI-payment-flow-on-EE

https://blog.impulsepay.com/post/170580247572/ee-flow-changes-15th-february-2018

These changes came into effect in February, and have the effect of requiring a double opt-in for all subscriptions and not just those at over £4.50 per week. 

The supposed subscription in this case pre-dates the application of these rules.

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@madi86 wrote:

Definately after going through this forum and very much convined EE doesn't care about its customers. May be they are getting some percentage on every charge applied from third party.

Shame on EE allowing your customers to be scammed by these scammers.

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Like all of the networks, EE make money from these third party charges. They won't say how much, but when these systems have finally been exposed in other countries it has been 15%-20%.

I'd like to be able to help you further with this, and in particular I'd like to see a case taken to court, as I believe that could help stop these scams for once and for all.

Please take a look at the resources on http://payforitsucks.co.uk.

It's not clear whether these charges have been made through 'Payforit' or through EE's 'own portal', but the advice on that site applies to both anyway.

Don't forget also to complain to the Phone-paid Services Authority about these unauthorised charges.

Let me know if I can help you further, either by through the payforitsucks website or by PM here.

Paul

[moog]

EE reps, You are still fobbing people off to the toothless PSA despite the fact that bounce games are in partnership with EE via an own portal service and are getting a lot of commission from this. This has been going on for years now. Shame on EE!

Customers: If you need proof then try to acces the following url on a mobile device any network other than EE... it won't work .. only works on EE as they are in an exclusive partmentship using an EE payment portal.

http://games.bounce.mob

XRaySpecs.. I see you are still patronising customers... how very noble of you. I have reported you and hopefully you will not receive your incentives this month.

[moog]

After Friday 25 May  I suggest that everyone report EE, Bounce.games aka PConnect Ltd for non compliance of GDPR regs as they are storing your personel data (phone number and EE account details)  and subscribing you to a service without your explicit positive consent. The process is also initiated by sending  your mobiler number in an open http url... also a breach as you not allowed to send PII data unencrypted.

[moog]

I also believe that all the networks should not be able to offer third party service access to your account without your concent explicit under GDPR. Currently they are doing so without knowledge of existance or consent from customer. GDPR regulation has been designed to stop this kind of practice and the penalites to companies can be severe.

So please complain.