topic Re: WAN port only working with certain sources. in Broadband & Landline

WAN port only working with certain sources.

stupink — Thu, 23 Nov 2023 21:23:20 GMT

I have both the newer white modem, and the model before. both seem to behave similar. Ideally i want to get the white one working properly.

Firstly my broadband works fine, but when I have had an outage I've tried to use my 5g mobile with an RJ45 adaptor to feed the wan port of the router so i can use all my normal devices without signing them into a new wifi account. The white one doesn't like it one bit, the older one will work for 5minutes then stop but only if you restart the router with it all plugged in.

The odd thing is that when it stops working, i can unplug it from my phone and plug it into my new router as a source, and boom, internet again.

I thought maybe my phone or the RJ45 connector is overheating or something, but no, if i plug that into my mini-pc lan port, i can sit there using the 5g for hours without a problem.

So in short the router will accept Lan > wan for ages no problem

It will accept RJ45-5g adaptor, sometimes, but for 5mins only after restarting router.

and Rj45-5g will sit happily feeding another device for hours, but put the two together, and its a no go.

Any thoughts? I kinda understand the basics, but i dont know enough to know what may be wrong, i do feel it should work though.

Re: WAN port only working with certain sources.

Mustrum — Thu, 23 Nov 2023 22:12:10 GMT

@stupink the Wan ports on EE routers are not designed for that type of use, they are for connecting to a modem and to use the PPOE credentials to get internet access. They can get this via the DSL port or the WAN port, but not bothe at the same time. Connecting an internet source via a Lan port can make it work as an Access Point.

To do what you are trying to do, you need a router with dual input such as some from Asus or Vigor

Re: WAN port only working with certain sources.

stupink — Fri, 24 Nov 2023 08:17:01 GMT

Thankyou for taking the time to reply,

I did not mention but I unplugged the phone line whilst doing this so there was no input from my fibre, with that in mind do you feel it should be working or not?

What I'm trying to do is use my fibre all day long, then if i have a outage, and/or a large download where the 5g speeds would be beneficial, unplug my phone line, plug in my phone/rj45 to the wan port, and continue using the same wifi for all my devices but now powered off my phones internet.

Is that what you mean by access point? and it should work? or is there another reason you think it shouldn't work?

Re: WAN port only working with certain sources.

bobpullen — Fri, 24 Nov 2023 10:34:08 GMT

@stupink - very much doubt you'll get it working reliably. The WAN port is configured for PPP authentication, something I doubt your handset or mobile network knows anything about. I'm surprised you've got it working on either device in any capacity at all. Even if it were to work, I suspect things like CGNAT on the mobile network might also complicate things.

Once connected, the PPP layer of the hub will also probably expect regular keepalive packets from the broadband network. If it doesn't receive these then the connection will drop, which might go someway towards explaining the behaviour you've seen with the older of the two units?

Re: WAN port only working with certain sources.

stupink — Fri, 24 Nov 2023 15:10:23 GMT

I can't really comment on any of the more technical stuff as it's somewhat hidden behind menu's and networking is without a doubt my least competent computer skill and for a home user medium to kinda okay at best.

My phones a note10+ 5g, samsung build in an option in the menu's for tethering, you can do this with a hotspot, bluetooth, usb, or ethernet via an adaptor like I'm using. So to get the phone working all i do is activate the "ethernet tethering" option, which only becomes un-greyed out when you plug in the usbc-rj45 adaptor.

What protocols the phone uses/expects /accepts I really wouldn't have a clue.

What I do know is other people have done this on other routers, and it typically feeds the WAN port fine and works. but im aware broadband provided units are often "not quite right" as to how they work and only focused on doing their primary job, giving the wifi to the peeeps

Any thoughts on that additional information? or anything I can do using my laptop/mini pc etc to test the phones output to try to get a better idea what's actually going on.

Re: WAN port only working with certain sources.

bobpullen — Fri, 24 Nov 2023 20:01:30 GMT

@stupink wrote:
What I do know is other people have done this on other routers, and it typically feeds the WAN port fine and works.

What routers and what Internet providers?

I've no experience with Android tethering over ethernet, however I imagine the WAN port of the router would need to be configured to use DHCP or something like that rather than PPPoE. You may well be able to do this using aftermarket equipment, but it's not something that's possible with the EE hub.

Re: WAN port only working with certain sources.

stupink — Fri, 24 Nov 2023 22:01:04 GMT

I've seen it with TPlink and cradlepoint , they litterally just turn on ethernet tethering and plug it into the wan and it works. no playing around.

One mentions ensuring routers set to dynamic ip. I'm wondering if this could be where the issue comes, as when i plug the phone in the router goes through the normal front-light flashes as though its trying to connect to EE still, flashy blue, solid yellow solid red. it's not just looking for my broadband because it stops/restarts this process every time i plug/unplug the wan cable.

Has anyone used the WAN port for anything other than what EE intended? it's looking to me like they have its use locked and its only going to accept EE fibre or something.

What would be a decent replacement router for me that will work with my 60 speed EE fibre? A little extra range by default would be nice so i can reach my garage without putting in repeaters/cable, but its kind of a low value thing for me to make this work, So i'd rather not spend too much.

Re: WAN port only working with certain sources.

Mustrum — Fri, 24 Nov 2023 22:25:43 GMT

@stupink how often is your broadband going down? Maybe your efforts would be best focussed on resolving a line problem if you have one.

That said, the router I currently use is an Asus DSL -AX82U it has seperate 2.4 and %Ghz bands and WiFi6. It also has con a DSL and WAN port that can be configured to switch from DSL to WAN on DSL failure - and other options -but this is what I think you are looking to try and do. But as mention on my earlier post, other dual port routers are available - how much do you want to spend and how automated to you want the switchover to be?

Recent EE routers are based on the same base model use by BT and Plusnet and are designed to keep things as simple to support as possible with very little options to do anything other than the basic functions.

Re: WAN port only working with certain sources.

stupink — Fri, 24 Nov 2023 22:52:25 GMT

My line is currently stable, but it's only just been fixed recently and i had about 4-5months of "we've fixed it sir" repeat repeat repeat. which is what's instigated this project.

So it really is just a backup in case kind of thing so happy to swap over manually (it's not like it will be plugged it all the time anyway), my main use would more often be just to utilise the 5g speed when downloading new games or some of the steinberg software that's like 100gb+, as I get 250meg+ on 5g and only 60 on my broadband. the range on my phones hotspot is poor and the signals only good upstairs in the bathroom, so i'd like to dangle it in the window on a long lan cable.. then all devices can access it without re-signing in etc.

Thanks for the info on your router, i'll have a look at that one, its within my price range, the other option im pondering is just a non modem router and have it fed by the EE one. I presume this would result in a similar setup, but just a bit less flexible in ways i'll probably never notice. but would mean if i ever swap provider i can just plug in whatever router they provide and keep everything in the house on the same wifi network without swapping things over..

Slowly starting to comprehend everything, thankyou so much for your help and patience.

Re: WAN port only working with certain sources.

stupink — Fri, 24 Nov 2023 23:00:53 GMT

I meant to also mention I would have liked to put an SSD on the router for access, and EE loves USB 1.0 making it next to pointless even when it does decide to work. so that would also be a nice upgrade to get an actual useable port 🙂

Re: WAN port only working with certain sources.

Mustrum — Fri, 24 Nov 2023 23:54:38 GMT

@stupink you really need to work out what your requirements are, you make a few worrying presumptions.

1. Which router do you have, most EE routers cannot be set up in modem/bridge mode - so connecting another can add other issues and problems. Possible to get around, but a seperate modem for the DSL line would be better.

2. Do you have the option for any full fibre in your area? Either Openreach or another supplier? If like me you are stuck with FTTC for the foreseeable it will be worth getting something similar to what I have. .

3. Routers in general are designed to do stuff with ethernet, USB is an afterthought and fine for charging or keeping things powered - if you want to share data then a proper NAS really should be the way to go.

Yes I know it all costs, but at the end of the day you get what you pay for.

Re: WAN port only working with certain sources.

stupink — Sat, 25 Nov 2023 11:50:00 GMT

I have the latest white smart router, and the older smart hub, yes i did presume it could feed a non-modem router.. heaven forbid they provide a router that can actually do useful things.

no full fibre yet, and my cabinet isn't in the prority list so thats not gonna happen for a while.

3. i'm only on about chucking some media files on it for accessing across the platform, i've done this on my smart router before and it works as i want it to, just as usb1 speeds zzzz so im sure on usb3 it will be more than fine.

going to pickup the router you have now, seems like it will do what i want for now at the least 🙂 thankyou for all your help.

I really understand why providers routers come locked, but why on earth you cant unlock them in the menu's is beyond me, anyone who can find the advanced page get into it and understand what they're unlocking should be safe enough to use basic features like a wan port or usb tethering etc.. oh well 🙂 more electronic waste for the landfill!!

Re: WAN port only working with certain sources.

XRaySpeX — Sat, 25 Nov 2023 14:03:07 GMT

1. If what you want to do works with the black Smart Hub & doesn't with the white Smart Router & you are still on EE Fibre (VDSL) why don't you just continue using the black Smart Hub?

3. Both the Smart Hub & the Smart Router have USB 2.0.

Re: WAN port only working with certain sources.

stupink — Sat, 25 Nov 2023 18:48:39 GMT

Thanks, the old router works intermittently and only for 5 mins max then stops working and needs rebooting, it seems to be a bug in the firmware that it works at all as the router software goes a bit loopy whilst it's working, then when the wan stops working the router software kicks back I to life again.

I'm properly shocked they're usb2? From memory I was getting 1-2mb/s from an SSD. Must be other limiting factors then involved.

Re: WAN port only working with certain sources.

stupink — Fri, 08 Dec 2023 20:42:04 GMT

Thankyou for all your help.

I've been using the modem a while now and really love it. I got everything i want working via usb>RJ45 adaptor, but thought hey if i use usb modem it will charge same time.

Got everything setup and working as fallover and just pulled the dsl cable.. worked great on 4g+ and then my phone picked up 5g signal and nothing.. whilst the router does mention 3g/4g, the phone app does mention 4g/5g so i presume 5g should work. really odd. did you ever try this? i did a google, but trying to google the problem was pointless just kept going on about 5ghz issues. seems really random that the router would care what network the phones on, unless its doing some of the modem work or something and not just tethering in a typical way. wierd 🙂

Re: WAN port only working with certain sources.

Mustrum — Fri, 08 Dec 2023 21:22:50 GMT

Hey @stupink glad to hear you are making progress and things seem to be working.

As for me, no I have not tried it via my phone - it is on the things to do, but not got round to do yet.

You could try changing your phone to only use 4G data, it is probably the switching bit the router does not like, so anything you can do to keep a stable source has to help. It is amazing what phones can do these days but maybe a 4G router might do a better job, or at the very least close down all the apps on your phone.

Re: WAN port only working with certain sources.

stupink — Sat, 09 Dec 2023 16:32:58 GMT

Thanks for the update.

it seems to work okay using the rj45 so i'll just stick to that for now, the usb would have let it charge at the same time with only one cable and not needed more complication of adding a charging cable to the adaptor also (the good signals in the bathroom so shouldnt really be running power in there).

I have asked asus for their input, i'll update you if they have any useful replies.