topic Re: Devices long paid off in Contracts & Billing

Devices long paid off

atomicsushi — Thu, 04 May 2023 17:32:10 GMT

I have an Apple Watch and a mobile wifi. Both devices paid off 25 months ago. Since then EE has continued to bill me every month for the device not the sim or the connection. I figure I have paid over £1000 that I was unaware of. Has anyone else had this problem?

Re: Devices long paid off

Chris_B — Thu, 04 May 2023 17:40:32 GMT

@atomicsushi that’s because you’re contracts change to a 30 day rolling contract at the minimum term until you call and give 30 days notice to terminate or you upgrade.

Contracts don’t just stop at the minimum term date as you’ll be cut off even if you was abroad

Re: Devices long paid off

XRaySpeX — Thu, 04 May 2023 19:11:24 GMT

EE's contracts have no concept of paying off the device. You agreed to pay the same price for the full duration of the contract. There will however be a 10% discount 3 months after the end of min. term. You may always choose to upgrade your contract to a cheaper SIM-Only contract from the last 45 days of your contract term.

Re: Devices long paid off

atomicsushi — Thu, 04 May 2023 20:50:37 GMT

I upgraded my contract at least once since the 25 months that my devices were paid off. I have been with EE over 11 years and with Orange before they were bought out by EE and have made many upgrades to contracts and phones. But previously the devices would have a term of payments and then once paid in full, the payment would end and new payments for new devices, data, calls etc would start. Now it seems unless terminating payment for a device no longer in use only can happen if you mandate it. This seems extremely unfair.

It's as though I bought a £10,000 car with financing by the seller, to be paid for (with interest) over a term of, say, three years, and after three years the loan was fully paid off but the seller continued to charge me the same monthly payments I had been making for the past three years. It's clearly unreasonable. The reason given to me when I spoke to someone at EE on the phone was that they can't stop charging the same amount without violating privacy laws. That makes no sense.

Re: Devices long paid off

Leanne_T — Fri, 05 May 2023 06:50:53 GMT

Morning @atomicsushi

Thanks for coming here.

The contract would continue if you do not get in touch with us to change plans, upgrade or cancel.

If you would like to make changes please call us on 150 and the team will help you further.

Leanne.

Re: Devices long paid off

atomicsushi — Wed, 10 May 2023 19:06:46 GMT

Sorry, but turns out that EE has been accused many times before of these sorts of sharp practices to the point that intervention has been called

for from Ofcom. Citizens Advice has said that EE was guilty of charging customers extra for their handsets after they had been paid off. The providers did not clearly separate the device and the service charges in the monthly bill. I'm out of pocket by over a thousand quid. The elderly were especially targeted.

Re: Devices long paid off

Chris_B — Wed, 10 May 2023 20:31:19 GMT

@atomicsushi Your contact doesn’t change to a lower tariff once that contract reaches its minimum term that’s down to you to upgrade to a lower tariff it’s in the contract T&Cs that you agreed too. And EE do offer contacts where the device and tariff are separate should you wish to have that sort of tariff. You’ll just pay the device over a longer period of time. It’s down to you to decide on what you wanted to do at the minimum term date. You decided not to do anything about it and just let it continue. If you had of upgraded then your old tariff would ceased as its an upgrade, if it wasn’t an upgrade but a new contract you’d would’ve have been paying for the old and new contract. EE never ceased a contract at the minimum term date unless you give notice to terminate.

Re: Devices long paid off

atomicsushi — Thu, 11 May 2023 09:54:15 GMT

I have always, faithfully, over the 11 years gone in to renew my contract and upgrade the phone with the assumption that the old devices (paid off in full) would then cease to be charged. The problem is that there is no way to separate the payment of the device and the payment of the calls. According to Citizen's Advice Bureau more than 6,000,000 people were still being charged for mobile phones they had paid for. EE can rollover charges for calls/data but should stop at charging for a phone that they know is long paid off. But the worst is being gaslit by EE saying that the reason it doesn't stop the charges is because of privacy issues. The issue bears looking into. It's an elegant scam. simple and effective.

Re: Devices long paid off

Chris_B — Thu, 11 May 2023 17:24:32 GMT

@atomicsushi if you upgrade, even to a Sim only your current contract will cease that includes the device so that contract is paid off. You will then only have payment for your new contract and there is no payment for the previous contract/device as that contract has been fulfilled. You are not charged for the device from the previous contract once you change to a new contract.

You have ignored what I have said that if you want a contract and a device on separate payments you can.

It’s not a scam if you actually read your contract T&Cs and don’t assume that at the minimum term the price will change on its own. It’ll only change when you do something about it. That’s why you read the T&Cs of a contract

Re: Devices long paid off

WarrenB68 — Tue, 24 Oct 2023 13:08:22 GMT

Yes I’ve just discovered £1100 extra paid for phone over 18 months since my contract finished and went rolling from May 22.

Re: Devices long paid off

Colstalex — Tue, 24 Oct 2023 13:49:47 GMT

EE haven't until very recently offered split contracts whereby the device plan falls away when paid off. I am afraid you are mistaken. Their contracts were all in for device and plan and not separate.

Recently they have started splitting them.

Re: Devices long paid off

roboreeves — Thu, 09 Jan 2025 16:50:31 GMT

This has happened to me and it is disgustingly sharp practice and is morally wrong. For me it is a watch, yes I saw the reminder saying the contract was over and I thought great, just the sim to pay now.

Where was my letter or email warning me I am paying a lot of money for a watch that i have paid for!

Why are EE not looking after their customers. Why are they not paying us the money back that they clearly know are not owed to them?

Re: Devices long paid off

Chris_B — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 08:25:04 GMT

@roboreeves So you knew it was coming to an end and yet still didn’t do something about it. You should have called to given notice to terminate than you could have changed it to a sim only for the watch at a much lower price point. Did you not read the T&Cs at what happens at the minimum term ?

Re: Devices long paid off

roboreeves — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 13:11:00 GMT

it is very easy to say that when you know. I did not read the T&C, it was set up over the phone and there are so many agreements that are made I do not have time to trawl through T&C every time, it is not like they are generally clear of easy to understand. Yes a mortgage and a car loan etc but this was a watch with a company i thought to be reputable. I think you are just being very self righteous condemning people for not read evert T&C that come across their path. i have not read Yahoo emails T&C when they pop up on the screen for example. I do not think I am alone with this, i think many people skip the T&C using judgment over what is important at the time. The fact that I remember very clearly on the phone agreeing to a 24 month term and there was now warning at the time saying they will continue taking watch payments even when it is paid. It is so immoral and dishonest that it did not even cross my mind they would start stealing from me. I just thought it would revert to sim only. I did mislead in my previous post, I did get notice that contracts were coming to an end but I have five of them and I did not have time to check which one and just decided to let them role and sort it out later. I do not think that is unrealistic, who would think that EE would continue taking payments for something paid for. Even if I am wrong in that assumption, which clearly I am, why are not EE looking after me? Why would they not phone me or text me with something clear, like "your watched payments are complete, if you do not change your contract you will be making unnecessary payment". The reason why is sharp practice and no level of client care.

So Chris, when I get older I want to be as perfect and amazing as you are and have all the time I need check all contracts and assume even the household names are out to rip people of if they possibly can.

Re: Devices long paid off

Peter_W — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 16:04:42 GMT

Hi there @roboreeves, welcome to the EE Community.

When your contract is coming to an end we'll always aim to let you know, but it's the customers choice on what they choose to do next.

You can upgrade, switch to SIM Only, or opt to cancel outright, but we want this to be your decision.

If you're not happy with the charges you've seen here, I'd recommend reaching out to our customer care team so we can bring up your account and have a chat about your experience.

You can find all the details you need on how to reach out to us on our complaints code of practice.

Peter

Re: Devices long paid off

Chris_B — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 19:25:07 GMT

@roboreeves Every contract you’ve had with EE was setup exactly like this. It was only last year that EE introduced flex pay tariff for phones. A flex pay is two separate contracts one for the airtime and one for the device so once that device is paid off your just left with the airtime contract. And seeing as you have/had a watch on contract you most certainly had a phone on this old style contract with EE.

And the T&Cs are what you are agreeing too, so even if you don’t fully read it at the time of sale there is nothing stopping you from reading it at a later date to understand what you’ve actually agreed too. It’s you’re responsibility to understand a contract and the T&Cs of that contract and not reading or understanding it doesn’t mean it’s not applicable.

Re: Devices long paid off

roboreeves — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 20:42:32 GMT

EE said nothing and did nothing to warn me that the watch payments would continue beyond the contracted and agreed 24 month period. Sure there was notification against one of the 5 phone numbers that a contract was coming to an end but I do not even know three of the five numbers. As I have said previously, it is not a natural assumption that a company would continue taking money for an item that has been paid for. It is very sharp, dishonest frankly. Trying to take money from people like me that have not read the T&C because they trusted EE. It is easy sport isn't it, because you just say, "haha you idiot customer you didn't read our T&C". I agree I am an idiot, I am an idiot trusting EE and assuming they would not try and rip me off.

Re: Devices long paid off

roboreeves — Fri, 10 Jan 2025 20:54:54 GMT

Well Chris, who has not fully absorbed my last reply to him, I had thought you were all knowing but not now, you are absolutely wrong, I have never acquired hardware via a contract before, it is the first time, so how am I to know without trawling through lengthy T&C. All my other and previous contracts have been and are sim only. What you say, it is my responsibility to read the T&C i have already agreed to you on that, you can follow and tell me again if you like. BUT, not explaining it at time of sale AND not making it clear in the reminders, in fact, purposely hiding this important bit of information; is sharp practice. In fact from what you just said, what's the bet EE were made to change the contract for phones and lucky them, no one mentioned the watches so they could continue scamming people with them instead.

Re: Devices long paid off

Chris_B — Sat, 11 Jan 2025 09:43:55 GMT

@roboreeves So you just admitted you’ve never had a full device contract and you didn’t/don’t understand the T&Cs of what that entails or even took the time to read the T&Cs after you got the item and your not going to take responsibility for not reading the T&Cs and you seem to think that EE have done you wrong? Just because you didn’t read the T&Cs at any point over the 24 month minimum term of the contract that you agreed too it doesn’t mean the T&Cs are not applicable.

I want I want but I don’t want to take responsibility for what I’ve agree too. That is exactly what you are saying.

Re: Devices long paid off

bristolian — Sat, 11 Jan 2025 10:25:29 GMT

@roboreeves wrote:

EE said nothing and did nothing to warn me that the watch payments would continue beyond the contracted and agreed 24 month period.

Checking your bank statements and regular payments regularly, helps identify situations such as this. How far beyond minimum-term are you?